dyils said:
Candor said:
Why didn't Yamamoto use Bankai against Aizen?
The Shinigami's endurance for everything (hunger,breathing,pain..etc) is 10 times more than a normal human, using a Bankai that can make the Shinigami suffer could massacre tens or hundred thousands of people outside of Karakura Town, which would eventually cause the world crumbling because the balance would be destroyed.
They didn't have to find near Karakura. Remember what Ichigo did to Aizen? He facepalmed him away. Remember Mugetsu? If that didn't do anything to innocent bystanders, I doubt Yamamoto's Bankai would, but then again he is Overpowered.
dyils said:
What are you all talking about? This chapter was great? How so?
First of all, I can't yet believe that there can be that much of a difference in strength between Yamamoto and whoever is second strongest.(Even though I might not know who is second strongest, anyone else clearly pales in comparison to Yamamato)Yamamoto is over 2000 years old, how on earth wouldn't he be that strong?
It doesn't matter how old he is. I doubt he's the only old Shinigami. I don't mind him being strong. I don't mind him being the strongest, after all he's Captain Commander for a reason. But I DO mind it, that he can probably fight all captains, vice captains, Ichigo and anyone you can think of, by himself.
The difference in power is WAY too big.
Heat that makes all the water in Soul Society gradually vaporize? Heat that would've killed Bach if he didn't have his Blue/Blut vene or whatever it's called, simply by standing close to Yamamoto? Can't you see he's suffering too? It also shows how strong these Blut Vene in defense are.
So you're saying he couldn't last a bit of suffering to defeat a threat to the world (Aizen)?
And exactly because Blut Vene is strong, Bach didn't die. But imagine if he didn't have it. How many Shinigami have a super defense like that? How many can protect themselves against heat?
This just shows how overpowered Yamamoto is. He'd probably defeat any of the captains, just by standing near them... As noted by Bach, the only reason he hadn't died is because of Blut Vene.
I have no idea what you're talking about in the first paragraph (could be a typo or something). Yamamoto and Aizen were in Fake Karakura, how and where could they move the fight to? Yamamoto's Bankai is way too over-powered because he's over 2000 years old (I think he was 2000 yo when he established a dojo, we still don't know much details about that part), but really, how come age doesn't matter?
in the 3rd part I meant Bach was suffering some minor damage from Yama's Bankai.
And THIS guy could not defeat Aizen himself, who didn't even try to use his illusions? Or at least wipe out the Espada?
Ichigo had to lose his power instead. And again THIS guy never joins the fights (This is his first serious fight in the whole manga), instead leaves everything to others.
Can't you realize that Yamamoto is in a condition of rage? He lost his calm because he lost his discipline and he's blaming himself for what's going on, he didn't finish off Bach 1000 years ago. He was calm in the Living world because he trusted his Shinigami, the organization he built, the people he raised for hundreds of years.
He trusted they would sacrifice themselves or their powers, yes.
I said this once in the beginning, I'll say it again. How is it possible that there's such a huge difference in power between the strongest guy I've seen so far (Yamamoto) and everybody else... I'd accept his strength if everybody was near his level, even if not quite as strong. People who won't die just by being near him... Who at least stand a chance... Like in Dragon Ball! (Not that I've seen/read it).
Humans with very little to no Reiatsu disappear when there's a huge Reiatsu near them (like Aizen's), Humans with higher Reiatsu don't, Shinigami have 10 times the endurance of a normal human. Check the last chapters of the Arrancar arc again.
I don't need to check anything. I'm perfectly aware of that. But Bach said, he's alive only thanks to Blut Vein, otherwise he would've died from the heat. And I don't know how you figured Shinigami are EXACTLY 10 times tougher than a human, but let's assume they are. Aizen needed to be 2 feet from a low-reiatsu Human for him to disappear.According to what Bach said, however, he would've died just by standing near Yamamoto. And I don't think Bach would have a low reiatsu. Plus, he wouldn't even die from the reiatsu, but from the heat.
There's a difference from being burned to ashes and disappearing from the pressure of the reiatsu. The 10 times endurance (it's actually 9) was mentioned in chapter 12 and explained thoroughly in the Character Books explaining Soul Society. Here is the info from Wikia (check the overview)
IMO, Yamamoto fails the manga as a whole. Not just in this chapter. There have been many chances earlier in the manga, that he could've done something.
The old guy going to the front-lines while his soldiers remain stand-by? Why the hell did he make Gotei 13 then if he can destroy everyone by himself? Or why did he formed Gotei 13 when he can't trust his soldiers?
Stand-by? Fighting Quincy, who've stolen their Bankais you mean. Trusting your soldiers is fine, leaving everything to them every damn time (Remind yourself how many times Shinigami have been in life-threatening danger) and fighting once in 500 chapters is not okay. They were in life-threatening situations and he came to the rescue and said: "What a shame making your elder appear on the front-lines" or something among these lines.
Quoting user @Wannabiteme:
""10 trilion of... " seems to be "big number" but we merely see 20-30? But I love chanting.
ps. Aizen once said that he achieved max level in shinigami's arts. Then he & Ichigo "level up" into x-times stronger creatures. Now Genryusai makes "mugetsu like attack" not even losing anything like Ichigo. And I think that he was able to do this long time ago before Aizen. Main question - is Aizen some stupid person not to train hard. I mean you can achieve all this power simply being shinigami, not some shinigami-hollow-something form."
Although I disagree with the statement that Aizen was a fool not to try harder, @Wannabiteme has some right. Supposedly, Aizen and Ichigo leveled up beyond Death Gods, with Reiatsu so powerful it could not be felt by normal people. In Ichigo's case it couldn't be felt by anyone... not even Aizen, who's reiatsu couldn't be felt by normal people. It was that powerful. But then loses all that power in one all-out-attack.
And now we get Yamamoto saying he might destroy Soul Society by accident... RIGHT...Ichigo didn't have Reiatsu when he fought Aizen, his Reiatsu disappeared because he got rid of them to gain The FGT.
Again, Yamamoto is more than 2000 years old.
You caught me not paying much attention in the newer chapters, but this time you're the one who didn't pay attention. Ichigo did, in fact, have reiatsu. Do you not remember what Aizen said, when he saw Ichigo's Final Getsuga Tenshou? He saw all of that black Reiatsu leeking from Ichigo and said he still couldn't feel it.
And remember how Aizen explained, that just as 2 dimensional beings can't interract with 3 dimensional beings, no human or shinigami can feel his reiatsu. He used that example to illustrate the difference between himself and the rest. In other words, Aizen's the equivalent of a 3 dimensional being and the rest are equivalent of 2 dimensional beings.
So after all of that, he said something like: "You couldn't be on an even higher level than, I?"
How do you think he used Mugetsu, if he didn't have reiatsu, when all his attacks, including Mugetsu and Getsuga Tenshou are Reiatsu Based attacks. Aizen just assumed Ichigo had discarded his reiatsu, but then admitted he didn't even know how he has done it. As we find out later, his initial assumption was wrong, so yes, Ichigo DID in fact have reiatsu. Ichigo said he exchanged his Reiatsu with FGT, at first he didn't have Reiatsu, his Reiatsu was released all at once to make him Getsuga Tenshou and he lost all his powers after that. That's what I remember from that fight, I'm re-watching and I should reach that part in a couple of episodes.
I ignored Kenpachi's sudden unexplainable power-up. I simply thought it's ok, it doesn't make Bleach less intresting, it's not that much of a main plot part anyway, but now this?
Regarding Kenpachi - Remember his fight with Ichigo, who had only 1 month experience of being a Shinigami? Now remember Ichigo's fight with the 6th strongest Espada - Grimmjow.
Now remember Kenpachi's fight with the 5th strongest Espada - Nnoitra.
Sudden unexplainable power up much? Kenpachi had already been a shinigami for many year when he fought Ichigo, who had been one for only a month. That's a clear indication if Ichigo's talent and faster Power-up.
Since then, Ichigo had learned Bankai and Hollowfication (The mask thing). He has progressed a huge lot. Then suddenly fights Grimmjow and has a relatively hard time, untill Nnoitra came and overwhelmed him. And then Kenpachi shows up and One-shots Nnoitra, who's supposedly even stronger than Grimmjow.
But as I said, I ignored that, it was a one-time fail. And now Kubo presents us Yamamoto - The Goku, planet destroyer of Bleach...*sigh* So you tell me when you fight someone and he beat you up then you beat him dead, then another guy comes to fight you, you can defeat the 2nd guy? You'd be like a ball in that 2nd guy's hands. Kenpachi was about to die before he one-shoted him btw. Also, Ichigo was going emo because of Orihime when he fought Grimmjow, Orihime screamed for him and Ichigo started getting serious and he defeated Grimmjow. (Bleach is shounen, let's not forget that)
You're quite narrow-minded aren't you? How come you didn't understand what I said. Ichigo struggled whithGrimmjow, who was weaker than Nnoitra - A man, Kenpachi defeated quite fast. You said Kenpachi was about to die, but don't you remember how he lost against Ichigo, when he didn't even have Bankai OR his mask? Now suddenly, he defeats an opponent, stronger than Ichigo's opponent, who he struggled with. If you can't understand this explanation, I can't help you.. Ichigo and Kenpachi's fight was a draw btw. If you read what I said you'll understand what I meant, I'll explain more: Ichigo fought Grimmjow, he looked at Orihime she was scared at him, Ichigo went emo and was distracted from the fight so he got his ass beaten, Orihime screamed to him which means she got over her fear, Ichigo concentrated on the fight and defeated Grimmjow. After that Nnoitra came, Ichigo was beaten up by Grimmjow, you don't think he can fight Nnoitra after just being beaten up now do you? Kenpachi came to the rescue, both sides got beaten up but at the end Kenpachi, after being on the verge of dying, pulled a Kendo attack, which actually makes sense, using both of your hands does make the attack stronger. Bleach is typical straight-forward action shounen manga, ass-pulling attacks and everything I said is normal in these types of manga.
Either way, something will be explained about Kenpachi in this arc, probably why he's getting stronger with each arc, this was mentioned in the latest novel.
