Bleach Chapter 451 Discussion
- Thread starter Deathlock
- Start date
- #3
I never suspected Ginjou was a villain, always thought he wanted to seem like one for make Ichigo release all his potential. We all know when Ichigo's friends lives are in danger he will go berserker.
- #5
I believe that he created wary in Ichigo's heart to both motivate him to join the Xcution and to speed up his transformation.
Question still stands, is Ichigo on the right side?
The fact he couldn't see how Ginjou felt in battle is suspicious enough.
- #7
Wasabi said:
So what will happen if Kubo suddenly decides to not make Ginjou an actual villain? Will Fai finally go away or just say it was the bestest damn swerve he's seen in Bleach, etc?
Why should I care if Kubo actually managed to make it believable and made it work? However if it will be as half-assed as Kishi's "tobi is madara w00t" trick was, then I would obviously complain. Its not like I hold some manga on pedestal above all criticism.
And why should I go away? Its a free forum. Its a free country, Its a free world. if you don't like my posts, you are free to not read them.
But as of now, all clues do point at him being the villain. Not the badguy(barring Mayuri there are no badguys in bleach), but villain. This chapter included.
Fai I love you and all but ....stop mentioning Naruto in these discussions completely irrelevant. This chapter honestly reminds me of something from Yu Yu Hakusho. The whole I'm a guy/bad guy and I'm gonna make the protaganist stronger for my own benefit or others. Don't know where he's going with that.
Ginjou is not to be trusted though.
Anyway one of the best chapters so far
- #8
lucjan said:
Fai said:
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Now I am sure Ginjou is villain. But that WAS slick on how he convinced Ichigo he is not.
Nice foreshadowing on cover too(Rain=despair, inoue and riruka's forming bond should make Riruka get over her own despair and make life easier) - Riruka most likely side with Ichigo and Inoue once FB's reveal their intentions.
Fai, did you even read the chapter? No, I bet you read the shitty, skimped out spoilers so you could make it "first". None of that happened.
I am sorry, but what?
thats exactly what happened.
If ginjou does NOT convince you this chapter that he is badguy then nothing will. its quite clear he wanted to gain ichigo's trust this way.
"-_- ~facepalm~
First of all, you get the idea that Ginjou's evil from a couple of pages in the middle of the chapter. But you find out at the end that it was just a ploy to make Ichigo complete his fullbring. How somewould would conclude (AFTER READING THE WHOLE CHAPTER) that Ginjou is evil is beyond me. It's absolutely ridiculous.
Second of all, the only thing that even related to Riruka this chapter was the cover art, which wasn't covered by Mangastream (i.e, since Mangastream's the only site that's released the actual, full chapter, Riruka doesn't even belong in this discussion). Not to mention she was only on the cover page. Nothing else was noted about her.
- #9
ye, it isn't decided that ginjou is a good guy. but still, I wouldn't be too sure bout that, fai.
maybe ichigo will fight against him cause he dissaproves of his methodes and riruka will see this as an opportunity to change sides
Oh I sure doubt he is outright bad guy. no villain is outright evil in bleach.
he most likely has reasons. But so far evidence(his smiles when badge talked, him making ichigo not trust isshina nd urahara, this chapter, riruka's reactions, etc) certainly point at him being villain.
I do wonder what he wants to accomplish or what his reasons for upcoming betrayal are. He obviously knows Isshin so could it be connected to Kurosaki family somehow>?
- #13
lucjan said:
Fai said:
lucjan said:
Fai said:
----------------------------------------
Now I am sure Ginjou is villain. But that WAS slick on how he convinced Ichigo he is not.
Nice foreshadowing on cover too(Rain=despair, inoue and riruka's forming bond should make Riruka get over her own despair and make life easier) - Riruka most likely side with Ichigo and Inoue once FB's reveal their intentions.
Fai, did you even read the chapter? No, I bet you read the shitty, skimped out spoilers so you could make it "first". None of that happened.
I am sorry, but what?
thats exactly what happened.
If ginjou does NOT convince you this chapter that he is badguy then nothing will. its quite clear he wanted to gain ichigo's trust this way.
"-_- ~facepalm~
First of all, you get the idea that Ginjou's evil from a couple of pages in the middle of the chapter. But you find out at the end that it was just a ploy to make Ichigo complete his fullbring. How somewould would conclude (AFTER READING THE WHOLE CHAPTER) that Ginjou is evil is beyond me. It's absolutely ridiculous.
Second of all, the only thing that even related to Riruka this chapter was the cover art, which wasn't covered by Mangastream (i.e, since Mangastream's the only site that's released the actual, full chapter, Riruka doesn't even belong in this discussion). Not to mention she was only on the cover page. Nothing else was noted about her.
AND I was exactly talking about the end of chapter. Sure it was also for fb reason, BUT ITS CLEAR THAT HE PULLED a "i am not a badguy" trick and got Ichigo's trust. If you can't grasp a simple concept then please facepalm while in front of mirror.
A good villain will either play a fool or a cliched fake villain to make hero drop his focus.
Let's make it simpled:
THIS WHOLE CHAPTER = Ginjou making Ichigo trust him for bad reasons.
ANd why excuse me from looking into cover for foreshadowing since every color bpage by kubo had foreshadowing for events to come. SOme of those did noteven come true yet(like divine dual-headed eagle) and some came in a volume or less (Ichigo's hollow2 form hinted at cover art). Let me cover it slowly so even you can understand:
RAIN = Sorrow and despair in bleach world.
Cover = Riruka and Inoue hiding from the rain implying their bond that formed last chapter will eventually make Riruka get over her despair like inoue did.
Hence: Foreshadowing that RIruka will join good guys once fbs reveal intentions.
Sometimes it seems like people like you just skim through the chapter without even trying to grasp the reasons behind events.
Oh and I am sorry i should have waited 50 minutes after chapter release even if no one started the thread, so little scared cats don't freak out. Now be happy I am not reporting your first post in this thread as flaming. I am sure someone else will though.
I'll admit that Ginjou probably has a dark side to him, but that he's a villain? Villain's are generally introduced in the way you're implying through pure kindness, as to completely throw off the other character. Obviously Ginjou didn't give off that impression, as Ichigo even stated that he hadn't trusted him to begin with.
A good villain will generally resort to trickery. I can guarantee that Ginjou's not the villain you think he is. It would make no sense.
This whole chapter was focused on a variety of things, such as Ichigo's progression, and Ginjou's personality. Trust was merely the sideline.
Your predictions are absolutely outlandish, that's why. And notice how all the past cover's only imply aesthetic predictions?
I read the chapter twice. Everything you said is completely too out there. It's all way too predictable, and ridiculous. And even though Kubo may be poor from time to time on his writing, that doesn't mean he's completely hopeless.