Vampire Knight Chapter 89 Discussion

ragingx said:
1) So, killing purebloods is equal to giving someone a gift? Scheming to have the events surrounding Zero's past happen is a gift? ...



Quote shortened to keep post shorter.



1. That was just one example, clearly you ignored my other ones. Zero has never killed anyone? ... um maybe you're forgetting that guy from the first half of the manga, his name started with R, he had an obsession with Yuuki's mom? Not saying Zero killing him was a bad thing but you should pick your words more carefully. And Zero hasn't always shown loyalty or care for Yuuki:



Chapter 37 Page 12



Chapter 43 Page 38



Chapter 54 Page 21



I also think we're reading a different manga because Kaname seemed perfectly happy as long as he was with Yuuki and when she wanted to be with him. It's being separated from her, and not being number one in her heart, that makes him dead inside, the only reason he separated himself from her and wants to jump into the furnace right now is because she wasn't laughing from the heart (a line straight from this weeks chapter)



2. I don't get how it would be her obsession, he lied to her about Aido-dono and has been lying to her since the beginning as she stated in this chapter it would be logical at this point to assume it was a lie. Fine, you want examples of her standing up to Kaname:



Chapter 56 Page22



Chapter 57 Page 13



Chapter 57 Page 14



Chapter 65 Page 25



Chapter 65 Page 26 (Maybe not as much but I love this scene XD)



Plus there was the fight scene in chapter 81, in that one you can't blame her for not being able to kill him because:



A) He stroked her cheek in the middle of battle, such a gentle action probably taking her by surprise and throwing off her concentration



And



B) Ruka put her under an illusion



3. Already provided examples of what Zero has done above, and just because he hasn't pulled the trigger doesn't mean it's him treating her as an equal the very fact that he POINTED the gun at her has shown that he saw her as a vampire and therefore not equal.



5. It's not romanticizing it, it's saying that it's perfectly acceptable to sleep with your fiance even if she is in love with both, because she was never in a relationship with Zero. Until she actually tells Kaname it's over she hasn't voided 'that engagement', and I don't think stopping Zero from killing himself and allowing him to drink her blood would void the engagement. If she hasn't spoken it, then it doesn't work. That's like saying my boyfriend moved and I lost contact with him so I guess it's over, it leaves things unresolved. I also don't get your last statement, yes people age and their feelings change but Yuuki still loves Kaname, the fact hasn't changed in the manga and she's also recognized the fact that he is her fiance.



6. What she can't be a mature pureblood vampire? She needs to be human in order to mature herself? I think she's doing just fine the way she is, and I don't think she's stupid to not accept getting her humanity back, it would mean sacrificing Kaname who is someone she cares about, I'd rather have her stay a vampire and work to keep Kaname alive than let him sacrifice himself.



7. Kaname didn't take advantage of her, taking advantage of her would imply he was the one that would be clinging to her and kissing her. Rather she was the one holding him until it became painful she even kissed him. And he said that he would do it if she would have him:



Page 33



Page 38



Page 40



8. She starting to care? She does care for him:



Chapter 88 Page 40



But there's also that 'But I...' after the kiss:



Chapter 88 Page 41



Which can be interpreted many ways as Hino-sensei has not finished up that thought yet. I interpret it as 'But I love Kaname more'. You make this chapter seem like it was really out of the blue when it wasn't.  Yuuki ultimately believes in Kaname, she trusts him:



Chapter 73 Page 20



Chapter 73 Page 21



I guess whether you choose to see it as obsession or love and her going back to Kaname as random is your problem. I've said my piece and I'm just going to agree to disagree.

Sabamiki said:


ragingx said:
I just noticed this but its yet another thing about this chapter that was completely out of sync with where the story was at. Kaien said in the past that he wouldn't hand Yuuki over to Kaname, then he hands her to him going against his own words? Seriously Hino what were you thinking when writing this chapter =.=



I think Kaien understands that telling Yuki to go to Zero wouldn't be right or make sense. He doesn't remember her.



Also, it's better that they stay apart now, at least until Yuki sorts herself out emotionally so that she doesn't screw things up further. (Though that's bound to happen anyway. :P)



We can see that Kaien is still apprehensive about it just by looking at his expression. He doesn't look pleased about anything right now and I'm sure there's a lot that he wants to say and get off his chest, but Hino hasn't given him that chance.



Boy, am I waiting for that. I love it when Kaien goes into badass mode. XD



He almost did a second before on Kaname but Yuki yelled at him. That really sucked. They both need a grilling for the total mess they've caused. .-.



I'm glad I have my spoiler back since I really like it for the sake of saving space.



Still I don't agree with this characterization of him. He should know that handing her to Kaname is: a) dangerous as 3/4ths of the people in the VK world want Kaname dead atm thus he and anyone around him are nuclear and b) in her current mental state the last thing she needed was to be left alone with Kaname who she's shown to have practically no self control around. imo it makes Kaien appear to be an idiot at tactics which is even more reason for me to dislike this chapter since I think he's one of the brighter characters.



Yeah, just too bad she wasn't smart enough and Kaname wasn't gentlemanly enough to keep himself from imo taking advantage of her in this state. But who knows maybe this whole b.s. will end up with Yuuki finally waking up to see Zero's affection toward her after he regains his memories through will and the depth of his love for her. At least thats the best I can hope for.



You realize you just made me want to ask Hino for a side-manga revolving around Kaien right, maybe squeeze in some Haruka and Juri arcs too? (half joking on this xD) Seriously I liked the first part better cause he was a lot happier and had a ton of more screen time.



Yes, he is awesome though at both being the class clown and at being a badass xD



Kaien almost stopped her from going to Kaname? or you mean Kaname tried to stop her from sleeping with him? (Sorry but my brain is like fried atm too little sleep and too much debating on this issue) I going to assume you mean the second since you already addressed the prior one above. Well Kaname should've indulged the inner Zero and told her that he wouldn't do that, pointed out the insanity of it, and proceeded to walk away or at least have her wait on a chair or something away from him instead of yet again spoiling her by letting her have her way. At least this is how I personally would've handled the situation.

Ok.... Now I really want to drop this manga.... I hate Kaname, I hate the mangaka, I hate Yuuki. And when I saw that Yuuki is going to be with Kaname... and had sex ok now I really want to drop it or the manga have a really really unhappy ending like Kaname or Yuuki dies. I hope some of them die, really...

In the beginning I loved the manga, now I really hate...

I just read it because I'm this far and it is soon end, but I hope it's not going to be a happy ending....

Lulexiaa said:
Orulyon said:
...(dunno if she is crying because she is losing her virginity or if its because she knows that might be the last time she will be with Kaname since she has plans to die in his place).



OHH NO!!! Why does she plan to die in his place? What would that solve? ;___; </3



She wants to make Kaname human (like her mother did with her, by giving her life to make her human). Like that Yuuki will stop Kaname from becoming the new parent.







Polychronicon said:
Demcrin said:
IchigoHollowfi said:
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

OOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!





I still believe in Yuuki x Zero D:!

This.



I still have hopes that they will end up together as well.



May be best if Zero never finds out his love was deflowered by one of his most despised enemies though.



I really cannot understand you guys. Are you Yuuki fans? because that is the only way I will understand why you still ship Zero with her. And Im not even talking about the sex scene with Kaname. Im talking about what she has been done to Zero through the WHOLE manga. She leaves him and then she cames back, she is unable to let him go and gives him hope. then she shatters that hope and does what Zero hates the most: behaves like a pureblood by stealing his memories.

For his own sake? Is that supposed to make me laugh? Stealing your memories is like erasing what you are. I have a lot of painful memories and I would never erase them. Our memories are who we are, we lose them, we lose ourselves. Taking away the memories of your most precious person is like taking half of your heart, leaving you incomplete forever. Not saying that Yuuki is not suffering, she is clearly, but she was fucking selfish.

If a person comes back to you ONLY when it doesnt have the other person at her side, that might be love, but clearly she loves the other the most, because she always returns to him.



Now as a Zero ultimate fan, I must say this: Does Zero deserves to be with a girl who is always running to other guy no matter the reason? Does Zero deserves to be with a girl that will only choose him if Kaname dies?

Does he deserves someone that will always have her heart divided and never love him whole heartedly?

Why to put a Zeki End if it has no logic at all? at all?????  Yume has more sense into it, even if I really dislike the pairing.

http://shizza24.tumblr.com/post/41276233477/story-of-a-story-suicide

That post resumes Yuuki´s attitudes. Read it if you´re willing to.

I feel sorry for Zero. I know she loves him. And she loves Kaname too. And she clearly made her choice without consulting Zero again, leaving him behind, again. She loves Kaname as a lover. You dont sleep with your brother like that. Also if it was really the case and she ended up loving him as a brother, that would make me hate her more than I do now. Sleeping with someone for pity makes you the worst, so I do hope she sees him as a lover and not a brother, otherwise it will be disgusting. There was a time I liked Yuuki. But her "confusion" let to extreme has been screwing up lives. That makes her disrespectful with other´s feelings.

For those who really understand how painful it is to lose the memories of your most loved one, you´ll understand my point. Its cruel. Zero has been a toy of purebloods all his life, I will rate this manga "1" if it has a Zeki ending. This coming from a Zeki fan who switched to Zero fan only right after Yuuki left with Kaname for the first time. Id rather see him alone forever.



This manga does not have logic at all for a long long time. Matsuri sensei really needs to clear up her ideas or stop being influenced by shitty Twilight.

ragingx said:


He's indulging her again (like a big brother would) and incest isn't a big deal to them anyway. But if you (not literally you but anyone who says it) say that Zero is just a 'best friend' to Yuuki then I'll say that Kaname treats her like a little sister. Basic point is: don't degrade Zeki by saying they don't have romantic love and you'll get no response from me. Though I do honestly believe that this explains his constant spoiling her and trying to push her onto a path he thinks is best for her, regardless of what she thinks, and in this sense makes me dislike Kaname a little less since big brothers are supposed to dote on and spoil their little sisters.  





Haha this is incredibly funny. Do you think it's normal for your older brother to want /desire you to have long hair and wear cute little high heels? HAHA



He's asserting his power over her for his little happinesses to visually please him because she's his woman and you don't just use power over someone like that because you think of them as a sister lol



btw that thing about him recognising her eyes is because of Yuuki going back to his past and him seeing a "vision of the future", his feelings for her are real and can't be compared to the ancestress lady. I used to think that maybe he did still love her after wanting to take over her job and let her rest but I think that was his self-destructiveness manifestating itself once more because he had come to believe that Yuuki's happier with Zero or loves Zero more, and she has had a hard time convincing him of otherwise. Hope he knows now xD

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                        ok, so like everyone knows already, the highlight of this chapter was the sex scene between Kaname/Yuuki.

Im shipping Zero with anyone. Anyone will do but Yuuki. Im rooting for Kaito x Zero actually, but I dont mind Yori or Maria

Congrats Yume shippers and from the bottom of my heart with all the honesty, Im truly wishing that Yuuki stays with Kaname forever (no, Im not being sarcastic) and truly wishing that Zero never remembers her face again.



Zeki shippers? Are you still there? Leave that ship please, you are disrespecting Zero by shipping it with a girl that does not deserve him. She loves Kaname the most, hence, Zero deserves someone who can love him wholeheartedly. IMO.



And well, everyone wants to die in this manga. jeezz.

So much to say about this chapter. I really do feel bad for Zero in this one guys. I've lost all respect for Yuuki. She selfishly takes away the all of his memories of her (presumably Kaname too?) w/o really thinking about the conciquences of her actions. She might think that she is "saving" him by taking away his memories, but imo I just think that she made things a whole lot worse. I remember in the first half of Vampire Knight (you know the first 10 volumes which were actually GOOD?) Yuuki was completely struggling with her lost memories. Even though she cannot remember anything, she still felt completely empty knowing that the memories of the first 6 years of her life were completely gone. Zero is most likely going to end up going through the same thing as she did in the beginning of the series. There are plenty of things  though that could trigger his (hidden?) memories to reawaken (like with what happened to Yuuki) or at least leave him incredibly lost and suspicious of his and her relationship.

1.)Lets just say Yori comes up to Zero in a later chapter (totally oblivious as to what Yuuki has done) and starts asking Zero about Yuuki. Zero being Zero, will absolutely deny having any kind of relationship (other than that of hunter and hunted) with a pureblood. Yori being Yori would try to explain that they were friends and would probably try to find some sort of proof too. If Yuki had not already thought of telling Yori to keep quiet to Zero about her (which I doubt because she's stupid and doesn't seem to think ANYTHING through). Zero not remembering any relationship with Yuki would probably just try to put it off but it would probably also stay in his mind and eat at him.

2.)You guys remember the gun he keeps under his pillow too right? If he saw that (if it still exists due to more than half of the vampire weapons being eradicated) he'd probably wonder why it was under his pillow in the first place. He could maybe just think that he had put it there because he's a hunter, but he could remember that he gave it to a girl and she basically gave it back but not remember who.

3.)One last thing I could say that would really make him try to seek out his missing memories is if he still has the Middle School Graduation photo with Yuuki (Not really going to go into explaination about this for ovious reasons).  

Remember, Yuuki was going to sacrifice herself in order to turn Kaname into a human. Now that they are back together, i'm not so sure that it will happen anytime soon. And like I said, she most likely did not think through her whole erasing Zero's memory plot which could lead to Zero being more unhappy than he already was.

I definitely see Zero getting his memories back eventually as long as Yuuki still lives. I'm not sure if I missed it or not but did Yuuki just seal away his memories inside of him (like Yuuki's mother did when she turned her daughter into a human) or absorb all of them into herself? Because either way there is most likely a way to get them back. He'd most likely get them back if he were to drink her blood.

Wow I was so surprised about the sex scene, i kinda feel bad for Zero but also relived that his memory's of Yuuki are gone