Vampire Knight Chapter 90 Discussion

@Naruto: "As far as Kaname's concerned, he doesn't give a shit about Zero" - Right, Kaname confirmed to be a scumbag that uses people like pawns. Most people knew this though.



@Yuna As funny as it is to see Naruto try and explain the action... Most people would agree with you that sleeping with someone to show them that they love someone else makes little sense and is entirely reprehensible.



It is actually super sleazy and a mockery to love in the first place. All it really proves is that the individuals involved are indecisive, incapable of sound judgement, and are quite less appealing than your average mentally functional individual. This shit is just a plot element for NTR/close calls type drama. Not common or realistic at all (That isn't to say that dumb fucks like these characters don't exist). It basically reminds me that fools need to make mistakes to get it right.

I suppose if the idea was to flesh out Yuukis character using those criteria, Hino should have done it sooner in honesty. It feels like within 4-5 episodes Yuuki has from *meh okay* status to *wtf woman!*.



If Yuuki had played out to be a confused teenager from the moment she was "vamped" then that would have made sense up to now. Instead what we have is a woman who has shown characteristics from like 4-5 different personas mixed into one. Confused, then direct, then insecure, then forceful and then and then and then, ad infinitum.



One thing about School Days however (uber shudder!!!) is that it was ear marked as a tradegy from the start, so something bad was going to happen eventually. This manga has never had that vibe thus far ... but that could change ...

Barbara-chan said:
Ah this manga's ending going to be a sh*t. If Kaname dies(die die die die) then probably Yuuki is going to born his child and be with Zero, and that is going to be wtf. If Kaname is going to be alive then poor Zero life was made miserable for nothing, good job-.-

I really hate this manga-.-



If Hino wants to beg for 1 ratings, that is the way to do it!! LOL

yunaleia said:
windeen-windy said:
There was not much reason for him to carry her around like a trophy, even if Zero didn't remember.

It was still mean and vindictive to him and to her to do that.



Apparently that is something the major reader base in east enjoys ... Otherwise why would they like Kaname so much? Mass speculation on my part here but with some particular posters on this forum that I have witnessed, this seems to be true ... apparently.



In other news, I've just finished reading KNIM 219 and holy hell! Completely different authors but again this scenario of the female lead thinking that sex is the ultimate test of ones love for another?! This increases my confusion levels exponentially, women cry for equality but in mangas this is what they are reduced to doing ... No attempted sexism here, merely pointing out a very awkward state of affairs.



lol, well, I've been seeing it as a plot twist for years, so it's nothing new to me, though I didn't know it was in manga till VK. But, even though I know about it..... I find it a disturbing way for an author to do things.

And I find it extremely demeaning towards female characters.

It's insinuating that women are too stupid to know what they want. So have them do something drastic to force them to choose.

As a plot twist- I understand it somewhat.

I find it disturbing and demeaning.... but I suppose there are those who don't.

yunaleia said:
I'm a compulsive forum browser, but I tend to not say anything unless it gets to me in a really positive or negative way. Some topics I find quite bland so I don't bother, VK was this way until 89 then I had A LOT to say.



Although I always prefered Zeki over Yume, I always told myself that in the end it would be Yuuki who makes the decision based on whatever transpired through Hinos depiction of events. Everything is cool, then at 86 the Zeki swing got going (again) by 88 page before last you were really left with "It's gonna happen" and then Kaname (insert troll face + trollololol music) stops the festivities. Okay, I'm cool with this because in some ways the men will always fight and the woman will be indecisive. I understand she has hurt Zero in multiple ways and I dislike her for it, but thats plot and portrayal, I get on with it.



Then 89 ... I think it was said that VK could have started at 88. Forget the other 87 chapters of story. Yuuki beds Kaname under the pretense of what? Do I love Kaname or Zero more? I obviously need to do something to confirm one way or the other ... Ehh?! Grow a spine woman! Confusion or insecurity aside, this is a primal desire, sex, with which one is connected to the other (lets leave out the whole blood/blood of vampires) where both understand each other. Yuuki doesn't understand jack. Let alone this desire.



I push blame towards Kaname insinuating in a manner that lead to Yuuki making a decision based on actions she has yet to fully understand. I'm forcefully making myself think that 89 was just a troll chapter, not just because of the sex scene, but because of HOW it came to pass. The fact it happened is unmitigatable. The facts of how it happened are not even subject to scrutiny or misinterpretation. To me, it is just downright dumb. I want to say it feels like a scene out of an NTR hentai but I'm sure I'll get blown to bits for even considering it ... you know what stuff it ... here we go.



In the worst form of NTR, the female is pushed into a situation she doesn't want because of circumstances that she feels she is unable to fight. Any woman with a backbone could easily get out of these however the NTR genre leads us to believe the female is incapable of doing so. Oppressed and subjugated she cannot escape.



Lets put this into VK and Yuuki. Her oppression begins when she is turned back into a vampire. She now has the responsibilities of a pureblood and is now the fiancé of Kaname. The feelings that grow from this, under the genre of an NTR are progressive, very similar to how she falls for Kaname from my POV. Her subjugation is brought about when she is forced into situations she cannot control. Presiding over the nightclass because of Kaname, before 89 she was hellbent on killing him/and or turning him human, having to remove herself from Zeros memory because when she dies for Kaname his thirst will only grow and be unsatiated. The theme going on here? It all points back to the originator, Kaname. Now NTR is about stealing the female from an already exsisiting relationship. Plutonic or not, Kanames words are "the feelings he has for you, weren't part of my plan" so a relationship did exsist between Yuuki and Zero, any fandom could see this, I'm not talking about love or any level there of, it still exsisted as a relationship.



So that is my take on it, deep as it is and as far out of the ordinary it is also, the layout of the characters and the way in which the story has unfolded, leads me almost too clearly down this road.





I agree with you, believe it or not lol. Completely. So, I'm at least one person who won't be mad/annoyed with you for saying it.

I started out liking Zero. Kaname I didn't care about either way, but then I started liking him as much as Zero.... however, after he turned her, and started acting more openly and we started seeing more of his personality and his mind games, My like of him quickly diminished. Then when he "Killed" Aidou's father I was done with him (I still don't understand what the reason for that

charade was fully. other than to get people to hate him. If so wonderfully done in my case).



I liked Zero a bit less when Yuuki managed to convince him that she had killed the original yuuki.... I think that shouldn't have been believed so easily. But that's neither here nor there, I figured that had to do with his emotions being screwed with, and to a point it was understandable.

Something I just remembered whilst rereading the chapters before the time skip.



Hypothetical situation. Kaname does indeed love Yuuki, duh, however there is a particular fact about this which could cause issues. His love for Yuuki goes beyond affection and attraction. It is dangerous. Even before he forced Yuukis awakening you were shown scenes whereby Kaname was forced to not feast on her, it indeed hurt him quite severely.



Now for the important part. Kurans are supposedly the "kings/queens" of the vampire race with a blood lineage unsurpassed by any other. Note that Kanames visit to the council ended with 8+ lord level vampires strangling themselves (though this could be in part due to his power up from Shizuka). During one specific panel, I believe it was after the "dogs of the council" had come to execute Zero, Kaname blew a hole cleanly through a wall. Lack of control of power? He knew that absorbing the blood of another pureblood would increase his strength yet he wasn't able to control it properly.



Why mention all of this? Yuuki is infatuated by Kaname in the earliest chapters, this is undeniable, however, what would stop Kaname, consciencely or even subconscencely make Yuuki love him slightly more than usual? He doesn't need to bite her to make her a slave and up until her awakening she was just a human. There is almost nothing stopping him from doing this and even post awakening, Yuuki is nowhere near the level of Kaname to notice if this is indeed happening to her or not.



Totally hypothetical just to reitterate.

Well I'm glad that I am not in a minority of people who believe that how Yuuki has handled this whole situation is ... weird? confusing? dumb? I can't really think of a proper adjective to describe how I feel ...



Orulyon said:
WUT? NO. So after all the years of intense pain that Zero has been through, besides having the misfortune of being in love with the crappiest heroine ever, he would die at end?

Fuck no. That boy cannot die without feeling true happiness at least once in his life. Id rather see him go gay with Kaito.



I can understand the wanting of Zero being happy, truly, however in death he needn't worry over such trivial things ... apart from a well placed bullet between Kanames eye brows ... (wishful thinking). The way in which Zeros character has been mentally and physically abused is detestful. How one cannot feel any form of sympathy for him is unbecoming of anyone calling themselves human ... Family? Dead. No friends. His one and only love? Betrayed him for the man who is responsible for the former ... It's like Shakespeare suffering from dysphoria!



As a man I'm afraid I can't agree with the whole yaoi ending, but I guess I'm open to suggestions of anything that is not Zeki XD

ok so my apologies every1.after posting i read the other comments n my point of view sucks.from wat u guys r saying yuuki n zero wont be getting together ever again.man no wonder i hated this manga after some 10 chapters.seems to me like this is coming to 1 of the worst possible endings in manga history.(since the autor mentioned that the ending is near)