Vampire Knight Chapter 92 Discussion

Raven_Shinobi said:
Yeah, the main storyline is a mess, but Kaname and Yuuki ending up together had been in the cards ever since the begining.



With all due respect, I must disagree.  For this particular manga, I don't think you can make the argument that the main storyline is a mess, but a certain pairing was planned out from the beginning.



In VK, the plot and the Love Triangle are totally interwoven into one another.  In fact, the mangaka favored the LT above the plot.  If there were some direction, some forethought put into one side of the story (whether the romance or the main plot), it would have in turn improved the other side of the story.  



And overall, I think if the general readership had a sense that ANY part of the manga was actually planned, fans would be a lot less disappointed than they are now.



As things stand now, people are confused, and were caught off-guard with the way things developed (plot and romance-wise), and it doesn't matter WHICH side of the shipping line you stand on.  That's not supposed to happen in a good story.



On the romance side, is there anyone who could have predicted sex would happen in 89?  I don't mean sex happening between Yuuki and Kaname in general, if they are the manga's endgame couple, sex is not unexpected, but sex happening in that particular chapter?  If anyone tries to say they expected Yuuki x Kaname sex in 89 before any of the spoilers came out, I'll call them a liar.



I think there's strong indications that Hino never knew which pairing she wanted until the last minute and she was forced to pick one.



I say this because of little things and big things.  One of the little things I noticed was in the preview for VK that appeared in MeriPuri.  The entire preview was Yuuki and Zero talking.  There was no mention of Kaname whatsoever.  If Kaname was absolutely supposed to be the lead male from the beginning, then why was he not in the preview?  As lead male, he'd be one of the selling points of the manga, and therefore should have been in that preview, no?



One of the big things I noticed, probably the biggest, in fact, was that Zero was essentially the main character of the first arc.  In fact, Hino herself joked about it in one of her side notes wondering who her main character was, Zero or Yuuki.  If Zero's role in the story was always supposed to be merely the Knight, the guy who makes it so the heroine could end up with the guy she really loves, then why did he get a starring role in the first half of the story?  There was no point in building up Zero to that degree if he wasn't a legitimate contender for male lead.



Incidentally, I think this is why he's being called "the Kuran's lapdog."  His role in the story has ended up being no more than that, I'm sorry to say.  If Hino had put Kaname and Yuuki together but let Zero achieve some well-defined major goal, something he'd been working toward for a long time, then that would've been great.  He'd be his own person, with his own storyline, and his own set of concerns.  Not someone who is a prop for someone else's storyline (Yuuki ending up with Kaname).  So "the Kuran's lapdog" it is.



Edit: And let me just say, I think Zero letting go of his hatred is nice from a character development standpoint, but no, it does not count as "achieving a goal."  Anything a character desires, works toward, and accomplishes is achieving a goal.  "Making Yuuki happy" is, unfortunately, the only thing that qualifies in Zero's case.

^

I ship Yume,but love all characters and my opinion wasn't based on Yume ship,but based on the current flow of the story.That's why I described each character in a different line. XD

Well sorry but by saying Zeki ending would make Yuuki a good person you are disrespecting the other ship.I know it's your opinion but I wish you would pay more attention to the flow of the story,each characters feelings and of course the feelings of the other shippers.

I like that you said Kaname is an anti hero but in your other lines you described him as a villain which he's clearly not.

Zero isn't a lapdog either. He is an emo kid cause of all the bad things that happened to him but finally he is becoming mature. He is making his own decisions and he accepted his own feelings. Neither Kaname nor Yuuki are controlling him.

I loved this chapter! Especially the whole Zero getting his memories back and everyone working together to protect the academy ^.^



AND NOOOOO KANAMEEEEE :'c noooooooo T-T



I laughed when Yuuki just grabbed Aidou LOL




DANGGGG :3

Here's the full translation: http://whitelilyscans.livejournal.com/6008.html



(I seriously have no idea what happen to the 'edit' function but it just keeps logging me out so I can't edit the first post. Sorry >_<")

Orulyon said:
I just wish with all my heart that Hino sensei had written her plot carefully. I don't see how she will explain every flaw in one single chapter.

For instance:

Kaname was asleep for 10 thousand years.

How the f*ck Yuuki´s parents were born? From other Kuran we never heard of? Why Kaname spent his life alone in the human´s village? What happened to his family? were they humans like the ancestress´ parents? Were they Kuran purebloods already? Why Kaname left?

What was the ancestress´ name? her purpose and goal was explained and she was not even given a name, her goal was to help humans because she "loved" them and her parents were humans themselves. How about Kaname?

What really happened to Rido, why his soul didnt die and got attached to Kaname? Was it because he was the one to awaken him?

Why Kaname released Shizuka, knowing that she would murder Zero´s family, and taking the risk that she would kill Zero too, leaving Kaname with no "knight" to serve Yuuki? He saw the twins playing the snow and "hey I have a big plan, they´re hunter twins, omg" and then Hino never explained what the plan was involving the twins.

Sara was the big villain "hey I wanna make an army and be queen" and then again her real intentions were never explained. Takuma´s conversation with Kaname was erased. Ruka, Kain, Shiki and Rima never stopped being supporting charas with no use at all.

Ruka "I love Kaname-sama and I always hated Zero, but hey, let me randomly out of nowhere protect Zero with my life when Kaname tries to kill him". Shiki "I wanna be with Takuma, because yes", Rima´s "I wanna be with Shiki because yes". Seiren "Im Kaname´s shadow but I ceased to appear and everyone forgot my existence".

Aidou "let me be a comical character till my very end with no development".

Because of Hino I freaking dislike everyone in this manga, and in this chapter, I disliked Zero.



As a Zero shipper, I disagree with the comments of "how you could forgive someone responsible for the death of your family". Let me re-phrase it:

I wouldn´t unless that person came to me to apologize with honesty.

What pissed me off it wasnt the fact that Zero forgave Kaname. It was the fact that it was Zero and not Kaname who took the step first.

It was Kaname´s duty to go to Zero and apologize. IT WAS HIS FUCKING DUTY.  HIS.FUCKING.DUTY.

And then, yes, Zero would forgive him and would say those cliché quotes he said. bUT INSTEAD THIS HAPPENED:

Zero:"Lets take them down together, grandpa! This is not really-because-of you, kay!(Tsundere mode)"

Kaname: *ignores him, doesn't care what happens to Zero or if he gets hurt while he is trying to save his ass and the ass of all humans in the school, humans that Kaname desperately wants to protect but instead ignores them all, turns his back and goes to a freaking tower to commit suicide because he really loves them all*

Meanwhile, Yuuki keeps being useless, is carried by another kuran lapdog, changes clothes to her school uniform because that is urgent, goes get artemis,bites Aidou from nowhere, drags him to save, let me quote "the school and Kaname", not even bothering to add "and Zero".

So screw all the characters in this manga. Including Zero. As a Zero shipper not Zeki I still wish him to have a happy end with Maria or Shindou, but then everything is screwed in this manga, Matsuri sensei might be one of the best artists Ive ever seen, but she is one of the most terrible writers Ive ever read. period.



LOL @ Yuuki changing back into her school uniform, I didn't even stop that think about that! Anyway, I would of loved to know more about the Hooded Woman (a name would of been excellent) and the Kurans' history in general so it would be nice if we got more info on them but unless it is in something that further expands on the series like a fanbook or in the novels I guess Hino won't be giving that information. Regarding how where Yuuki's parents born, I always figured that either Kaname had a child with someone at some stage or there must of been other Kurans besides Kaname and they were the ones which the future generations came from.

I feel like all the characters you mentioned were basically neglected by Hino to focus on the LT which is one of the things I've found disappointing about this manga for some time - there were are interesting characters outside of the LT and the potential to make this more than just a tragic love triangle has been wasted. I'll be keeping an eye out for Hino's next manga to see what else she can create but I think she still has a lot to learn as a writer, for basically the last 40 chapters I have only been reading for her beautiful art work and Zero. I actually feel like her writing could be a lot better if she had an editor that guided her more because she does have decent ideas but the plot so often turns out to be a mess and she neglects, doesn't expand on or forgets potential interesting plot seeds.

A number of people seem to be really upset about Zero's actions in the last chapter. I've always thought Zero's hate and anger towards vampires was very natural considering what happened to him and his family but that he was going to eventually let go of it. The thing is sometimes the person who is getting most hurt by hate is the person doing the hating because it's such a terrible emotion that holds you back from being happy. It's impossible to be truly happy when you're consumed by so much hate. People do sometimes forgive people who do awful things to them do it without receiving an apology - forgiveness on your own terms and deciding to let go and move on with your life is a very difficult thing to do and I don't think it makes Zero a weak character at all, it takes a very strong, emotionally mature person to forgive someone when they do nothing to earn that forgiveness.

00kiryu00 said:
Zero is the Vampire Knight of the story, since of his kind and pure heart. He got treated by crap by the characters of this story, lost his family and even lets go of the one person he desired the most.



Im not really bashing on Yume because that couple is valid and is probably the couple that will finish for the last chapter and I lost all respect for Yuki after that sex scene or bed scene whatever that was. Yume is like Haruka and Juri and Kaien is like Zero (although I dont want Zero to end up with the "weird and uncool" Kaein the mother) Just like Kaien, Zero will end up with no one and Zero in the end is probably going to be the leader of the hunters.



The only fact that Im sad about is the Kiryu family isnt going to have another generation D''': No more Kiryu :<<< asdfghjkl SPAZ Zero is the last Kiryu.



Although Yume won the ship.. yeah you can have the vampire Yuki... Zeki= I was all in for Yuki  the human(idc if she doesnt exist anymore, shes still alive in Zeros memories ok.) I just wanna reminisce the human Yuki and Zero back in the academy as disciplinary committee. Those were the days when vampire knight wasnt as crappy as it was now.



Well looking forward for the last chapter.. The last chapter of seeing Zero. Hes the only reason why I've put up with this series for so long till the end. Zero will be happy at the end. he will. he will. he will.





Very well said.  

But if Zero survives he might find a girl who actually appreciates him and make more little Kiryu's  I hope  :))      But that would be a different manga.  

I also preferred this manga back in the disciplinary club days and liked the human Yuuki but can't stand the vampire Yuuki.