Inarius said:
i wonder who the next captain commander will be since none of the current captains are at yamamoto's level...but I guess Kubo will prob appoint either Ukitake, Shunsui or Unohana.
I would love on if Unohana and Shunsui would butt heads over on how the place should be run now. Its quite interesting that Unohana was not in that captain meeting.
And with Ichigo's heritage, as I said before, its very likely that we will be getting some sort of split in terms of opinions.
Kanic said:
Fai said:
I mostly agree with what you said but that's the common tropes of shounen genre. The hero will always be special chosen one and he will always change things.
The irony of it all is that (after looking arround some interviews from the big3's authors) all of them have been inspired by Dragonball which lacked said concept.
Just tossing this out.
Fai said:
The fact that Ichigo is actually intelligent and a bit introverted and not just "hardworking relatable dumb guy" that the usual manga protagonists are(something about children being able to relate to such stereotypes etc etc)
Promoting such ideals to the younger audiences isn't such a bad thing actually.
After all, they are shounen.
Fai said:
I find it far nicer that Ichigo grew to be feared after SS and Aizen arcs.
SS did change but the change happened quite some time ago. After the massacre. The FB arc narrative from SS I took more of "we do not want to have Ichigo as the enemy and as long as we help him he most likely won't do what Ginjou did".
With Ichigo it was "We do not want to repeat what happened with Ginjou" but they still feared Ichigo (gathering most of captains to "greet him" when he came for the body, etc)
You have medieval japan conservative society who is reacting to this new powerhouse who pretty much goes against that conservative thinking.
Exactly, but these circumstances that define the culture/civilisation of SS are portrayed through random bits and pieces and not in a coherent and consistent manner, which is a shame because the rules that define both sides (HM and SS)
can raise some huge questions within the reader, but not when everything is just implied and not shown. Which is why the fandom has the idea that everything is a stepping stone for Ichigo alone(can you blame this opinion?).
Fai said:
And even in this very situation now - he did not beat the main badguy, the badguy just happened to leave, but demoralized SS NEEDS someone as their "lighthouse" for the lack of better words. Shinji knows that Ichigo might have done nothing AND was beaten, but spreading the word that he "forced them back" puts Ichigo as new source of morale for the troops.
For me that works far more nicer than usual "hero comes, beats back the badguys and everyone suddenly likes him" twists that are so common in the manga.
Sure Ichigo is still powerhouse special child who comes to save the day, but how it is done I find far more preferable here.
I find a demoralized destroyed land idolizing Ichigo as a new hope, deservedly or undeservedly, far more interesting than main character coming, beating everyone and suddenly everyone revealing that they liked him all along.
And I would love for all this to crumble to pieces by Ichigo freeing Aizen. Wouldn't that be awesome? But it would be awesome if Kubo took some time to portray SS's reaction to this and not just by one or two characters that are close to Ichigo.
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And in answer to the medics-issue. If things were to be portrayed according to Bleach's realism then it would be clear that :
a)this is an invasion and in invasions you need one place to gather injured, in contrast to a battlefield
b) the invaders had the advantage of range to take out the medics before they even get the job done(but this isn't evident cuz factors such as range are barely noticeable in Bleach's power system, which Kubo downright screwed up on his own)
Agreed about DB. It popularized a lot of those ideas(even though the roots of those tropes go even further down that road). That's one of the reasons why it will always have a special place in my heart. Seiya also did quite a good job at popularizing them (namely the whole "enemy after enemy" approach of writing, as well as fake deaths for good guys)
And yep, Ichigo's little secret most likely will be the cause of something serious happening. Its intentionally left unknown and with the shady situation in HM and the captains in SS arguing, the reveal is bound cause different reactions from everyone. That's one of the biggest things that this chapter excites me about.
Han-yuu said:
Apparently, there is difference between Normal medics and Comabt medics. Which you're alreaday told but refused to accept. And i don't need to tell you, what kind of power level Unohana have because you were the one telling everyone with graphs and whatnot, just few chapters ago. Taking care of top level guys should be piece of cake for her. Also as a senior captain, she was supposed to take part in every way she can do. If there were not those handicaps like "Time-over for quincies" and "RG's are coming, re-treat", then Qunicies were going to completely annihilate SS. BUT i know you will still say it's okay for Unhohana to stay in the building and wait.
Not to mention, bleach never involved war tactics. Otherwise we wouldn't have to see four captains losing their bankai on just one page. They didn't know what they're doing in their own home and outsiders took control on everything in just one chapter. They didn't know what kind of powers enemy have yet they were going out like "shoot me if you can", Shingamis scattering all over the place without any guidance, Yamamoto to be so sure of his bankai powers to defeat Juha Bach with just one-shot. Saying that Yama-ji was scared deep inside and told Unohana to stay in the barracks because you're our last hope if something bad happen and it's war tactic is SO funny.
Apparently you are missing the fact that SS is fucking massive - Unohana CAN protect her squad in closed off space like HQ, but she would have no way of protecting every single member of her squad when they are spread out through SS getting picked off one by one.
I do not need to be "told" the difference between combat medics, field medics and normal medics. Its just simply that in this case it makes no fucking difference. The focus has been to kill shinigami and cripple ss before the VR have to leave due to the whole shadow territory limit and advancement of RG.
As for tactics - those four captains got ridiculed by the rest of the cast for doing that. Everything else in this war felt like an actual war(unlike certain other manga). As for guidance - apparantly you missed the part where Quincies SPECIFICALLY targeted the communication teams and R&D guys first(last time we saw that was two or three chapters ago) - the prioritized targets were support. this whole blitz relied on shinigami being unable to coordinate a counter-offense. And that's yet another point on why it makes sense for medics to stay behind in this situation.
And I'll just ignore all the logical fallacies in the first part of your post because of how laughable they are. There is a lot of wrong with bleach(mostly start and mid of arrancar arc),(by my current rating it, it does not enter my Top50 and is around the same worth as stuff like Midnight Secretary would be) but yes, its still miles above nardo in terms of quality.
grandy_UiD said:
Fai said:
not to mention that the very intention of enemy army is to not leave anyone alive.
Considering that was (supposed to be) the case, they sure retreated nicely after beating the enemy leader and no one being left to put up much of a resistance...
(yes, Bach was gone but as someone already said his henchmen was strong enough to single handedly break Ichigo's Zanpakutou and most of the others easily held their ground against the captains, so they should've been able to wreak ALOT more havoc. Instead they just left...because the plot called for it)
Looking at it that way I'm not sure whether all of this "invasion" was properly thought through on part of the Quincy guys...
Royal Guards.
Bach clearly stated that he wants to regroup his forces before RG arrive to the scene, so that's why they retreated
Its basically bleach version of blitzkrieg. Bach relied on certain amount of time to inflict as much damage as possible, but thanks to Aizen, entirety of the main assault was carried out later than planned.
Planning was decent and frankly quite effective on quincy part (cutting off communication, etc), but they failed to account for possibility of Aizen trolling the hell out of Bach's sense of time.
Puty said:
but I can see some inconsistent/lame writing. Only Kubo knows why SR didn't blow up 4th Division like they did with the 1st.
The only one to really be at yamamoto's level seemed to be Bach. Unohana is almost as strong as yamamoto. And she was there.
Also as I said before, we do not know how 4th Squad headquarters work - for all we know there's some sort of protective kidou around it, SS equivalent of a bomb shelter.
In any way, its not exactly needed, since the explanation that someone of Yamamoto's level was there and prevented that was enough
4Th squad is incredibly weak in combat(minus Unohana). They are agile, a bit stealthy healers, with almost no durability. In normal confrontation it would make sense to send them out because no one would really notice them, but in this case Quincies specifically targeted support and with the 4th squad spread out, Unohana would not be able to protect her subordinates.
