Gintama Chapter 504 Discussion

It just kind of hit me, both zenzo and the shogun were not in the movie nor mentioned. I wonder if its because they both die here in this arc.

I'm still hoping that the shogun isn't dead. That it may be Zenzo's plan or something. Liked that flashback.Makes it all the more depressing.



Okita vs. Kamui? Yes please!

Where´s mah Katsura? Seriously, when was the last time Katsura appeared in a serious arc and did something badass? Where is our Noble Fury?



About Shou-chan dying...eh.



I think we are jumping the gun. It´s probably something along these lines:

The Shou-chan we see in the flashback wasn´t the Shogun - it was someone from the ninja school who looked like the Shogun - or maybe Zenzou met him somewhere else. The point is, Zenzou was killing the person he knew since childhood who was destined to take the Shogun´s place in a time of crisis - as he looks just like the real Shou-chan.

The bit about "if I become shogun" was meant in a sense of "if I take the place of the shogun one day". In other words:

Zenzou probably got his "way of the ninja" from that person. From a small age this person was trained and prepared to one day take the place of the shogun and "take the bullet" for him - if there should ever be a serious attempt at the life of the shogun himself. Zenzou, who didn´t care for any of that stuff as a kid, met that person - and was impressed by how he took his own fate - how he could smile despite knowing that his whole life will revolve around dying for someone else - living the life of a fake.

Or something like that.



I mean the whole "look closely at that dead shogun, old man"-stuff...he´s the best shinobi there is, we´ve heard this over and over again - do you think he´d leave any traces?



But if Sorachi really killed off Shou-chan...I´m impressed. It actually makes this arc so much better, especially if the relation to Zenzou turns out to be something really heartbreaking - as in he had to kill his old friend, because that´s what being a shinobi is all about - you take jobs for money and fullfill your mission. That´s it. Even if your target is someone you know and love.



Though I hope Zenzou doesn´t die - in my eyes, his Gintoki´s equal - as in Gintoki (seems) to be the strongest samurai. Zenzou is the strongest shinobi. They both like to slack off, read jump and try to act cool whenever they have the opportunity to do so - and they both have a demon inside of that, that once it is triggered, you´d better stay out of their way.



Also, the strongest shinobi alive shouldn´t die - at least if it´s not the last arc.

Kamui's adorable face when he gets excited~



YESSS!!! My dream of having Okita meet Kamui will soon come true ^o^



Let the bloodshed begin!

Holy F, at the beginning of the arc thought it would be a joke arc like always with the shogun. Heck last chapter was still in a funny tone now it's all dark and bloodshed, this is why Gintama is so awesome.



Kondou's eyes when he stab that dude was so bloodthirsty and Okita was all casual teaching the Princess about anatomy. This arc is just pure awesomeness right now.

I really hope the shogun isn't dead, but then I also don't know how I'd feel if he ended up being alive at the end... I have faith that Sorachi will handle it well, whatever happens! Also the art when Zenzo had the shogun's head was really good (and he has eyes, who knew?!).



Can't wait to see just how intense this arc will get! It does sadden me that Katsura appears to be on standby yet again.

Dead Shogun is a big ol' red herring, I'm holding my ground. There are people with faces that aren't their own all over these chapters, I think I'm not wrong to take that as a hint.



The supposedly greatest ninja around kills the shogun and makes sure to leave a witness? Fishy. If the death were the end goal he wouldn't leave witnesses, ninjas aren't supposed to leave witnesses. He's being intentionally ostentatious about it, attracting attention to himself



"Kamui: This time I've got a contest going with Shinsuke. To see who can take the real Shogun's head." He says "real shogun" so does that mean they don't know where the real one is? Anyway, Takasugi and Kamui's people are the ones behind this backstabbing/takeover operation so if Hattori were working for them they'd know they have the real thing in the bag, but they don't. So who else could Hattori be working for? Is he acting on his own? Because of his "duty"? But just killing the Shogun wouldn't achieve much, the other people aiming for his seat would all just scramble to get it first.



Things don't add up so far for me, so I think it's much more likely that he and Sho-chan are acting out a plan that's playing both friends and foes (and readers) than the assassination being for real.

                        ----------------------------------------

                        The rebellion has started! Damn, so many bloodshed!