Berserk Chapter 341 Discussion

sullynathan said:
I can already see it happening. The group will join guts and the guy's demon army will greatly help.



This mini arc has been precisely  about giving Guts via Rickert, the means to fight Griffiths army. Let's face it, other than Serpico and to a lesser extent Shierke, the rest of Guts' entourage is not much of a threat for some of Griffiths goons. the Bakiraka and Ganishka's wizard are another matter.

Isma found her mother :)

Will we ever get of the boat

That old fart was alive! I have to say I didn't dislike him.



I'm always suprised that most people seem to consider that the logic continuation for this manga is simply for Guts to kill Griffith and everything would be ok again.



But Griffith brought peace, not only between humans but between creatures and humans. That's why I consider Berserk to be a great story, not because Guts will take revenge but because there is this question is it the best choice to take revenge? There is a strong dilemma here.

This manga never ceases to surprise me, love it, my fav oat.



To actually see Griffith's envisioned kingdom fr just blew my mind, i love where this is going, and can't wait to see guts in some more action, but ofc i'd like a couple volumes or an arc for itself where things have kind of toned down, and where it's just guts trying to deal with all his struggles and try to become a much better person much like how Thorfinn had in Vinland saga. i think it'd be great for some more character development, that guts started to think a little bit over the things that's happened for the past couple years, but i know he can't atm, he's always on the go and in action, he never gets time to rest and think, he desserves much much better, i really hope he gets the rest he desserves in the future, maybe even at the conclusion of Berserk, guess we'll have to find out, but yeah overall masterpiece of a series, i love it!

G_Spark233 said:
Not with that attitude!



Hey . . . you're . . . you're right! Nothing can stop me now!

Monad said:




You should remember the words of Rickert after slapping him. The band was willing to fight for him and lose their life to help him achieve his dreams BUT that was for the Griffith they knew and believed he valued their lives too. It's one thing to willing to risk your life is another laying your life down like that like it has no value.



That is the thing though.....Griffith made it clear that he did not value or personally care about any of the band of the Hawk except for Guts.  Griffith's followers  may have thought he did, but from his actions and the things he said like "I never asked any of them to follow me." or "I only want to accomplish my goals", he never cared.  The band of the Hawk were just his tools to do with as he wished...right up to the end of the golden age arc.



The Band were not following a person who changed and was no longer the same person.  They were following the idea of a person who never existed to begin with.  Most of the members of the band of the Hawk were just infatuated with Griffith and sought his attention and approval but never got it.



The only time Griffith ever showed any sense of value for his band's lives was when he would attempt to minimize his losses, but that was more than likely just to minimize HIS losses and not weaken his forces



You said it yourself this post....'Griffith was a fighter of goals.'   That is who he was this entire time.  The people who followed him just never let themselves see that and falsely believed that the person that they admired thought more of them than he really did.

Malfegor said:
short_review said:
That old fart was alive! I have to say I didn't dislike him.



I'm always suprised that most people seem to consider that the logic continuation for this manga is simply for Guts to kill Griffith and everything would be ok again.



But Griffith brought peace, not only between humans but between creatures and humans. That's why I consider Berserk to be a great story, not because Guts will take revenge but because there is this question is it the best choice to take revenge? There is a strong dilemma here.



truth.



Griffith is essentially Messiah in the eyes of the people. If Guts were to kill him, he would go down in history as the Antichrist or something along those lines.

No one but an extremely small circle of people (Guts himself, maybe Rickert and Casca?) would even appreciate the murder of Griffith.



Emm.. You people forget that Griffith built his peaceful little kingdom by making the whole planet a monster nightmare it seems. Not exactly the best result.

Also Griffith was a conqueror and fighter with goals. His goal was a kingdom. As long as he had that goal he was unstoppable and that meant even sacrificing his comrades but now he has that. His like king of the world now and his not even human but a monster. So how long till he gets bored and turn everything into a nightmare?



Voradors said:
short_review said:
That old fart was alive! I have to say I didn't dislike him.



I'm always suprised that most people seem to consider that the logic continuation for this manga is simply for Guts to kill Griffith and everything would be ok again.



But Griffith brought peace, not only between humans but between creatures and humans. That's why I consider Berserk to be a great story, not because Guts will take revenge but because there is this question is it the best choice to take revenge? There is a strong dilemma here.



The whole thing is interesting.   The reason i like Berserk so much, is because of the very interesting moral ambiguity and interesting thought processes of the characters.



For example, i think the golden age arc was really really interesting.   To realize his dream, Griffith sacrifices all of his men/followers.   This seems incredibly evil, but the interesting part is that every single one of them says that they believe in Griffith's dream, and would give their life up to help him achieve that goal.  The Band of the Hawk would fight actual demons and willingly lay down their lives in suicidal situations for Griffith.

Then Griffith gets the opportunity to achieve his goal by sacrificing these same people who said that they were willing to die for him.  No long plans that may or man not bear fruit, no risks, no anything.  Just a guaranteed method to heal himself and get what he wants.

Those same people who would have died for him anyway, do so to get him what he wants.

I find that way of looking at it pretty interesting.   I am willing to bet that Griffith's rational on the issue was somewhat similar. Like, how much more evil is it really to sacrifice the men when compared to putting them on a suicidal mission where they would have died anyway and there is no guarantee he would have even achieved his goal by completing that mission in the first place?



(Then he got all crazy alpha male on Guts and Casca, cinching his evilness and "i dont give a fuck (haha) about you and i take whatever i want" mentality....)



Now Griffith has his goal accomplished, and like you said, he has achieved peace between monsters, humans and demons.  Saving more lives by far than he sacrificed.   So was the ultimate goal worth the sacrifices?  Can the people who died view their death as worth it for the greater good?  Will Guts getting his revenge ultimately make the sacrifice of the Band of the Hawk mean nothing??  Would they want that revenge carried out at this point?



Though......... was all the death that lead up to Falconia ultimately caused by Griffith's plan in the first place?





You should remember the words of Rickert after slapping him. The band was willing to fight for him and lose their life to help him achieve his dreams BUT that was for the Griffith they knew and believed he valued their lives too. It's one thing to willing to risk your life is another laying your life down like that like it has no value.